Justice for Voldi's mum
10th of April 2022
CheesymausI might just have opened a plot hole for myself. Or not. Anyway, is amortentia a difficult potion to make? I might be wrong, but they brew love potions in year 6. Excepting Hermiones polyjuice misadventure, it seemingly takes that long for students of Hogwarts to be able to manage it. And yet Merope Gaunt, with no education and bad wand proficiency and practically no funds was able to brew it often enough to keep Riddle senior under it for months? Either it is very easy to brew, Merope was a genius potions master, or plot hole?
I Live In Seven Clouds Probably Merope being a good potion master tbh
Cheesymaus So good that she is able to make up for 5 or 6 years of training with little to no education and resources?
I Live In Seven CloudsProbably had books and stuff in their house
And she's desperate
Very desperate
The resources thing would be the most questionable thing about that
But do we know what is needed for amoetentia?
Or the other option being Dumbledore was wrong in his assumption and she imperioused Tom riddle or something with her wand(?) Or someone else's wand
Queen of the Cards, Lady of EHoW that whole thing was weird as hell to me. he assumed that merope used a love potion and then he assumed that she stopped and that's why riddle sr left and then topped all that up with the assumption that this made riddle jr incapable of love
that's a whole lot of uncertainty to build your views on
could lead to quite a bit of trouble
I Live In Seven Clouds Wasn't that JKR tho
Didn't she say something about riddle not comprehending love and being born from a love potion was supposed to be symbolic
“I think you are forgetting,” said Dumbledore, “that Merope was a witch. I do not believe that her magical powers appeared to their best advantage when she was being terrorized by her father. Once Marvolo and Morfin were safely in Azkaban, once she was alone and free for the first time in her life, then, I am sure, she was able to give full rein to her abilities and to plot her escape from the desperate life she had led for eighteen years. “Can you not think of any measure Merope could have taken to make Tom Riddle forget his Muggle companion, and fall in love with her instead?” “The Imperius Curse?” Harry suggested. “Or a love potion?” “Very good. Personally, I am inclined to think that she used a love potion. I am sure it would have seemed more romantic to her, and I do not think it would have been very difficult, some hot day, when Riddle was riding alone, to persuade him to take a drink of water. In any case, within a few months of the scene we have just witnessed, the village of Little Hangleton enjoyed a tremendous scandal. You can imagine the gossip it caused when the squire’s son ran off with the tramp’s daughter, Merope.
Queen of the Cards, Lady of EHoW she irl might've decided that that was the case. but in the books, dumbledore wasn't there when any of this happened. he didn't find abandoned vials of amortentia lying around, or had access to riddle jrs blood as a baby to find the potion in his system, or poked around in the minds of either merope or riddle sr
unless of course he's being his usual asshole self again and refusing to divulge relevant information
I Live In Seven Clouds Like Dumbles says, i don't think it's particularly hard to deduce from the memories and rumours tbh
“Again, this is guesswork,” said Dumbledore, “but I believe that Merope, who was deeply in love with her husband, could not bear to continue enslaving him by magical means. I believe that she made the choice to stop giving him the potion. Perhaps, besotted as she was, she had convinced herself that he would by now have fallen in love with her in return. Perhaps she thought he would stay for the baby’s sake. If so, she was wrong on both counts. He left her, never saw her again, and never troubled to discover what became of his son.”
Queen of the Cards, Lady of EHoW it's just as possible that they were just being stupid kids and that riddle sr wasn't willing to take care of a baby
magic isn't needed for people to abandon their children, they just have to be neglectful assholes
Queen of the Cards, Lady of EHoW it's a cute theory he cobbled together but either it is important for harry to win (in which case he ought to be more sure in his conclusions) or it isn't (in which case they should stop wasting time with dumbles dumbass memories)
again, what jkr says outside the book is irrelevant to what the characters inside the books know. just because she has decided that this is how it happened does not mean the characters know it
she's just giving dumbles omniscience
I Live In Seven CloudsLol
Dumbles is basically what JKR uses to tell readers information
Queen of the Cards, Lady of EHoW thereby justifying his approach of "i will hoard all the relevant information to myself and sod the consequences after my death"
I Live In Seven CloudsThe characters don't know though?
He says multiple times that he's making an assumption
Queen of the Cards, Lady of EHoWthen she should give him a good reason for knowing
Queen of the Cards, Lady of EHoWyes but like i said, if it's relevant to the mission he needs to be sure and if it's not relevant it's a waste of time
I Live In Seven Clouds I don't agree
Queen of the Cards, Lady of EHoW clearly
I Live In Seven Clouds But sure
I Live In Seven CloudsComing back to this, im not sure if riddle being made of love potion was the reason he couldn't feel love was something dumbledore actually said in canon or if it was something made entirely by Fanon
Cheesymaus Lovage, Belladonna, ashwinder egg, billywig sting, a part of the person to key the feelings, that are the ingredients I could find. Is probably more.
I think ashwinder eggs are very expensive. But my point is. Even if she got a lot of better at magic , going from no education and barely able to use a wand to perfectly brewing a mastery level potion just feels unlikely to me.
StarsNowhere in the books is it actually specified its Amortentia actually. That's a fanon thing! Merope likely used something weaker but more constant
I Live In Seven CloudsNow that I think about it
True
Queen of the Cards, Lady of EHoW i still think it's a better narrative for tommy boy being an asshole for completely mundane reasons like teenagers hooking up and the guy bolting
he's so focused on how special his magic makes him
and how lame muggles are
it would be fitting if muggle things were instrumental in his failure to reach his goals, be it in nurture causing him to be a shit or in dying via muggle means
or at least being damaged by them
i'd rather someone throw bellas dagger at him in the confrontation than lyrical waxing over the allegiance of the bestest magic stick to ever magic
Kiritaru I'm going to one up this and say that merope may not have used any coercion whatsoever. The love potion idea was all Dumbles misogynistic guesswork. Who says that merope and riddle didn't elope on their own? Because those guys didn't find her attractive? Men leave their pregnant wives all the time. Riddle was a terrible person.
KiritaruAnd the whole idea that merope wasn't attractive enough to get a handsome guy is ridiculous. It's not like Brits are well known for stellar beauties and they all seem to marry just fine
knife gremlin Heir of HoS well i see what you are getting at, but on the other hand he is described as handsome rich dude, why should he marry an ugly poor women from an insane and antisocial family? i mean sure strange things like that happen... but how likely... on the other hand fuck the patriarchy
Kiritaru Maybe he didn't actually marry her and just wanted to have an easy lay. Noone was there but them .. And rich dudes like that are insanely entitled
Promising marriage and bailing when she's knocked up
knife gremlin Heir of HoS yea well but you don't disappear for a year with just an easy lay, you shag that as long as possible with the leas amount of work and the least likelihood of it being discovered...
god now i hate myselfe for writing shit like that...
Kiritaru Maybe he actually liked her? Who says she's ugly anyway. She might have been fun and interesting to be around.
knife gremlin Heir of HoS it is a possibilty we have not much information
i am just playing devils advocate here...
Kiritaru Point is, they just assumed that because they weren't the same attractiveness level that she coerced him. But when a typically beautiful woman is with a less typically attractive man, do we assume he love potioned her? Actually, we put it on her again and say she's using him for money, status, something
Let's take fleur's parents as an example of this
knife gremlin Heir of HoS nah i wont argue further here, even if i only play devils advocate i don't want to be seen as the misogynist for voicing disagreement here
Kiritaru Lol don't worry, I won't attack you but I understand the pitfalls because what's normal in society is also riddled with problems. I appreciate the devil's advocate. I'm mostly just pointing out that there are other possibilities because I hate that Dumbles says so, so we must take it as fact. But ppl get together and break up for thousands of interesting reasons. Just because that ass thought she wasn't attractive shouldn't factor... Especially since he didn't even like women so what does he know about it
knife gremlin Heir of HoS ( i would alrdy disqualify myself by quoting the wrong person so nope i'm out ) yes i see your point, and you are absolutely right there could have been a number of reasons and what does the gay dude know about female attractiveness and the like... BUT DUMBLEDORK IS THE GREATEST WIZZARD OF ALL TIME AND IF HE SAYS THAT IS THE REASON IT HAS TO BE TRUE!!!111
knife gremlin Heir of HoS fuck that dude... rly... i am like 99.9% sure the main issue with Dumbles is that he hadn't had a good lay since GG
Kiritaru Right? They did seem loyal to one another. Power tripping pricks, the both of them.
knife gremlin Heir of HoS and i am like 70% sure Riddle became Voldi, cause Dumbles was a little to interested in him... if you get my drift... a little to hands on...
Kiritaru thanks for the mental picture... I've seen that take. It's fair. I'm not sure if I don't agree with it or just don't want to think about it. I have a ton of sympathy for young Riddle though. Either way, the way AD treated him was horrible, unprofessional, and a bit mental tbh.
knife gremlin Heir of HoS you are so very welcome and well if he rly was afraid of Tom than how is what he did in any way the right thing to do?
18th of April 2022
Magpie she/her i'm rereading the bit in HBP where dumbledore talks to jules about pregnant merope and then takes him back to see baby Tom in the orphanage
and i want you all to know that i am outraged
by this man
wizard war criminal (she/they) yeah it's fucked up isn't it
Magpie she/her first he cuts harry off at the pass so harry doesn't start sympathizing with baby tom even though he should
anyone with a shred of fucking decency would feel bad for a kid born in those circumstances
and then to imply that merope had given up and that she chose to die rather than live for her son!!! like! no!
fuck you albus, a desperate woman hawking her last family heirloom in hopes of getting a room in which to give birth to her child is not the behavior of someone who's given up and wants to die
wizard war criminal (she/they) better to contrast lily's noble death with i suppose
Magpie she/her "hurr durr she didn't use magic bc she felt bad after tom sr. left her:(" more like maybe she never had any kind of formal magical education??
not like the gaunts appeared to have a single book around and clearly she didn't go to hogwarts
Sky-Bridges The part where when little Tom is like “well it couldn’t have been my mother who was magic bc then she wouldn’t have died” and Dumbledore starts going off about how Tom views death as weakness but I’m like bro maybe he just assumed magic would’ve been able to save her life??
wizard war criminal (she/they)yeah
Magpie she/her i would have!!!
that's the point. it's magic.
it's not like tom has a single goddamn idea what magic is and isn't capable of at that age
for all we know he's been able to heal himself on purpose or accident
canonically harry healed from stuff as a kid through accidental magic
Sky-Bridges RIGHT. All he knows is that he’s been using it to look after himself all this time so ofc he would assume it could fix a lot of things that might’ve gone wrong when a poor undernourished lady is giving birth
Theodore Z DiAngelo Tl;dr: dumbkedore is a fucking dick
Sky-Bridges Dumbledore’s inability to relate bc of his own backstory really shines through imo
Theodore Z DiAngelo I firmly believe he made sure tom became a dark lord so he could use that to keep his fame
Also pretty sure Merope was a squib.
[…]
Chaos Coordinator - she/her I really dislike the parallel also about merope never having Lily’s courage….meanwhile Lily’s son has been in the EXACT position of merope, standing at the stove cooking and not talking back, and dumbledore DOES expect Harry to die the same way